** Emergency Rally Against Immigration Raids **

Molson · Regular Plus

RE: ** Emergency Rally Against Immigration Raids **

Miel · Guru

DR J wrote:

From today's Star, "The rally, which drew support from about 200 people from the neighbourhood along with representatives from the Canadian Auto Workers and some local politicians, was sparked by stories that "undocumented" Portuguese immigrants had recently been stopped by police and immigration officials at the Dufferin Mall and were detained. The general manager of the Dufferin Mall has told tenants in the mall that neither the police nor immigration officials have asked for permission to come into the mall for such purposes. He said he could not find any evidence of such a sweep. Francisco Rico-Martinez, a spokesperson for the Canadian Council for Refugees, doesn't believe the story is anything more than rumours fuelled by fear. He said the council received at least 100 calls about the so-called sweep in the mall, but nobody was able to confirm that it had actually happened. However, No One is Illegal, the organization that held the rally yesterday, remains adamant that the searches and detainments at the Dufferin Mall happened. Sima Zerehi, a member of No One is Illegal, said her organization has received many phone calls from settlement workers who claim their clients have been stopped at the mall and asked to show their papers. But when asked for specific cases, she admitted she can't provide them because the settlement workers won't reveal the names of their clients because of confidentiality. "

So now,. it seems that it is just a rumour,...???

Who can start something like that?? Even the media has been given information regarding this,. ?? Raro,..

DR J · Guru

From today's Star,

"The rally, which drew support from about 200 people from the neighbourhood along with representatives from the Canadian Auto Workers and some local politicians, was sparked by stories that "undocumented" Portuguese immigrants had recently been stopped by police and immigration officials at the Dufferin Mall and were detained.

The general manager of the Dufferin Mall has told tenants in the mall that neither the police nor immigration officials have asked for permission to come into the mall for such purposes. He said he could not find any evidence of such a sweep.

Francisco Rico-Martinez, a spokesperson for the Canadian Council for Refugees, doesn't believe the story is anything more than rumours fuelled by fear. He said the council received at least 100 calls about the so-called sweep in the mall, but nobody was able to confirm that it had actually happened.

However, No One is Illegal, the organization that held the rally yesterday, remains adamant that the searches and detainments at the Dufferin Mall happened. Sima Zerehi, a member of No One is Illegal, said her organization has received many phone calls from settlement workers who claim their clients have been stopped at the mall and asked to show their papers.

But when asked for specific cases, she admitted she can't provide them because the settlement workers won't reveal the names of their clients because of confidentiality. "

DulceGalletita · Foro Master

El Representante wrote:

- Ecuadorian Protests - When Angry Ecuadorians Go After Politicians . . . Fac - That's Something Else . . .

OMG ... that is so true and the best part is the people get there way

My parents came here as visitors way back when and then overstayed hence "illegals: they had my brother and I but were aware that if they got caught would get deported itz a RISK!! If your illegal you know that one way or another you will get caught and be deported so why not try to get your papers in line ...

My parent's then decided to go back as they were afraid to get caught and be sent back and believed we would be kept here in Canada for being born here ... so they went back to Ecuador with my brother and I and we lived there almost 2 years and then came back todo en regla

So my heart is out there for these people but I can't say I don't agree with what is going on ... if people did the paper work correctly and all is as it should they could be here in Canada within a year or so ... if itz taking them longer then something is definately wrong ...

But there is always away to get around it ... and I know one or two there that are by rushing into marriage

The Fan · Senior Member

Toronto Sun Editorial

EDITORIAL: Refugee policy still too soft

We hope Sun Media's exclusive story about an alleged terrorist living in Newmarket puts the spotlight on Canada's refugee determination system back where it belongs.

That is, not on the phony issue that it is too tough on refugee claimants, but on the very real one that it is far too lenient in determining who is a legitimate refugee.

As the Sun reported yesterday, Raja Ghulam Mustafa, now being held by Canadian authorities for making a suspected bogus refugee claim, is also alleged to be a member of a Pakistani terrorist organization with ties to Osama bin Laden, al-Qaida and the Taliban.

Sources say Mustafa had been living in Canada for about one and a half years after securing refugee status and was poised to flee to the United States when he was arrested outside his home in Newmarket on March 16. He is now in the Toronto West Detention centre and his refugee status is under review after he allegedly used false identification documents.

Recently, a few dozen justified deportations of failed refugee claimants working in the construction industry in Toronto have made huge headlines, the complaint from their lawyers and supporters being that Canada's refugee determination system is flawed and unfair.

It's flawed all right, but not because it's too tough.

The real concern about our refugee system is that it is too lenient and that it is a sieve.

In fact, Ottawa has lost track of tens of thousands of failed refugee claimants over the years -- some criminals and terrorists -- who have simply disappeared.

And it's not as if it's tough to win refugee status in the first place.

A recent study by the Fraser Institute based on data from the United Nations High Commission for Refugees found that in 2003, Canada accepted almost half (49.1%) of all refugee claimants, compared to an average of 12.6% in 17 other comparable countries including the United States (21.8%), the United Kingdom (5.9%), France (13.3%), Germany (4.7%), Australia (9.5%) and Sweden (1.8%).

In other words Canada's acceptance rate was almost four times the average in the other countries.

And now we're supposed to believe it's too harsh? Nonsense.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now do you think the goverment is wrong or its just doing the right thing to protect us?.

MrPansa · Guru

Its sad to hear that many of our counterparts are being hauled away like savages due to their legal status in this nation, that we call home, its unfortunate to know that the people responsible for this atrocity throughout the GTA will go unpunished. Yes i said unpunished because the people who sent them were the ones we elected as our leaders. Meaning that we basically gave them permissionto do things this way.

If we wnat this to stop, we must first re-elect a counsil/commitee in the CIC (Citizenship and Immigration Canada)

bistor · Guru

miguel wrote:

LaDyBuG wrote:

I STILL SAY I FEEL BAD FOR THE GOOD, HARD WORKING PEOPLE WHO NEVER USED WELFARE AND STILL GOT DEPORTED....
\

it would be extremely difficult (ie: identity fraud) for an illegal to get welfare and they'd most likely be caught pretty quickly (the government has software to cross reference the SIN numbers of people on welfare with the SIN numbers of people who are legally employed to detect, and deal with this issue )

the immigration system is in need of an overhaul, that's for sure. i don't want to say i support illegals coming here, but a lot of people are doing jobs canadians don't want to do, like cleaning offices or homes. \the government should find ways to properly analyse work shortages and attract people to fill those work shortages, whatever the position might be.

right now we have a points system heavily slanted in favour of university educated, bilingual (french and english) immigrants. you don't need university grads here for toilet cleaning.

i guess what i'm saying is that i definitely support an overhaul of our immigration laws. let's get the right people in to fill our labour needs.

100% in agreement with you.

miguel · TOP Guru

LaDyBuG wrote:

I STILL SAY I FEEL BAD FOR THE GOOD, HARD WORKING PEOPLE WHO NEVER USED WELFARE AND STILL GOT DEPORTED....
\

it would be extremely difficult (ie: identity fraud) for an illegal to get welfare and they'd most likely be caught pretty quickly (the government has software to cross reference the SIN numbers of people on welfare with the SIN numbers of people who are legally employed to detect, and deal with this issue )

the immigration system is in need of an overhaul, that's for sure. i don't want to say i support illegals coming here, but a lot of people are doing jobs canadians don't want to do, like cleaning offices or homes. \the government should find ways to properly analyse work shortages and attract people to fill those work shortages, whatever the position might be.

right now we have a points system heavily slanted in favour of university educated, bilingual (french and english) immigrants. you don't need university grads here for toilet cleaning.

i guess what i'm saying is that i definitely support an overhaul of our immigration laws. let's get the right people in to fill our labour needs.

don_plyero · Guru

PRINCESSA · TOP Guru

I THINK THIS IS SUCH A BAD WAY OF THINKING! ONE REASON BEING THIS COULD BE SOMEONE IN UR FAMILY!! THEN U WOULD CHANGE UR MIND! OH AND DONT SAY NO CUZ I KNOW UR PRIMOS AND I KNOW THERE STORIES!!!

ok first & foremost I could give 2 rats a$$ if u know or not my cousins & their stories.

If you are trying to make me sensitive about the issue bringing up my cousins that I barely grew up with, then let me tell you, you got the WRONG girl.

As far as I'm concerned me & my immediate family is LEGAL & is fine, so if my cousins as you say don't have papers then too bad for them & if they get caught in any of these raids, then they're **** out of luck.

I personally DON'T make exceptions for anyone. I still stand strong & believe that these Immigration Raids are good for Canada !!!!!

MY SISTER IN LAW (SOON TO BE) WAS TELLING ME OF A FAMILY WHO HAD BEEN HERE 20YRS HAD BEEN WAITING FOR THERE PAPERS AND JUST NOW GOT TOLD THEY WERE GONNA BE DEPORTED SOON!!! THE FATHER OWNS YES OWNS THREE HOMES AND A CONSTUCTION COMPANY HE HAS EVERYTHING LEGIT!! THE GOVERMENT MISPLACED THERE FILE AND WELL NOW WHAT HE HAS TO GO BACK HOME???

With all RESPECT I very, very much doubt that anyone that doesn't have papers can own so much & claims to be Legit as you say.

So if it's true as you claim, then again too bad for them.

IM SORRY GIRL BUT SOMETIMES ITS CUZ OF UNEDUCATED IGNORANT THINKERS LIKE URSELF THAT WE END UP KEEPING THE CRACK HEAD KILLERS HERE!!!

Hun I'm not going to even argue with you on this, we both know I'm far from the above. I just think that the "Truth" hurts or hits some in a sensitive spot.

bistor · Guru

The Fan wrote:

i also know a lot of people that have came here ilegally, and most of them regret it they did it because of a BAD ADVISE from families and those piranas know as inmigration servives, most of them give them bad advise just to get money from them.
Most of the portuges that are been deported are because they were told to apply as REFUGIADOS and is well know that in PORTUGAL there is a democracy and no reason to claim refugio. so the blames go to the person that told them to apply as that, don't blame the goverment they just process the petition and realize they don't qualify as REFUGIADOS.
I think most of the people behind the WALK to PROTEST are probably those agencies that offer "Advise" to inmigrant just to cover there ass for giving the bad advise for and easy MONEY.
AND i am not CUADRADO and i am a CIRCLE (i am fat) and this is my opinion as a CANADIAN.

Here here.

The portuguese that came here illegally is specially baffling, since they have the right to live and work anywhere in the european union... an area that includes five of the ten largest economies in the world and many other countries with very high standards of living. I think them claiming refugee status was just a way to prolong their stay in the country... Toronto is very nice!

I can't imagine anyone seriously claiming political persecution in Portugal.

Don't take confu too seriously

LaDyBuG · Comandante

hElL wrote:

LaDyBuG wrote: CAN SOMEONE PLS ANSWER MY QUESTION..... I STILL WANNA KNOW WHY PEOPLE COME HERE "ILLEGALLY"? I MEAN....REFUGEE STATUS IS NOT AN ILEGAL THING....RIGHT? PLS EXPLAIN. Some people here come illegally, eg. A person who is in USA they just cross the border to look for new oportunities (different situations in every case). Others become illegal here e.g they come as Visitors and either do not renew their visa or just stay without immigration statatus after teh visa has expired. Refugee is not an illegal status. But once your case is refused you need to leave and some people stay in Canada.

OH I SEE....THANKS HEIL....

I GUESS PEOPLE HAVE THEIR REASONS FOR DOING THINGS ILLEGALLY SO THEY SHOULD ALSO BE AWARE OF THE CIRCUMSTANCES AND NOT "CRY" IF THEY GET CAUGHT.....

I STILL SAY I FEEL BAD FOR THE GOOD, HARD WORKING PEOPLE WHO NEVER USED WELFARE AND STILL GOT DEPORTED....

I HATE THE FACT THAT TAX MONEY IS GOING INTO SUCH MINIMAL ISSUES AS "DEPORTING" FAMILIES.....WHEN WE NEED TO FOCUS ON GUN VIOLENCE WITH TEENS....

confundida · Foro Master

The Fan wrote:

i also know a lot of people that have came here ilegally, and most of them regret it they did it because of a BAD ADVISE from families and those piranas know as inmigration servives, most of them give them bad advise just to get money from them. Most of the portuges that are been deported are because they were told to apply as REFUGIADOS and is well know that in PORTUGAL there is a democracy and no reason to claim refugio. so the blames go to the person that told them to apply as that, don't blame the goverment they just process the petition and realize they don't qualify as REFUGIADOS. I think most of the people behind the WALK to PROTEST are probably those agencies that offer "Advise" to inmigrant just to cover there ass for giving the bad advise for and easy MONEY. AND i am not CUADRADO and i am a CIRCLE (i am fat) and this is my opinion as a CANADIAN.

DO U EVEN KNOW WAT A CUADRADO IS??

hElL · Regular Plus

LaDyBuG wrote:

CAN SOMEONE PLS ANSWER MY QUESTION..... I STILL WANNA KNOW WHY PEOPLE COME HERE "ILLEGALLY"? I MEAN....REFUGEE STATUS IS NOT AN ILEGAL THING....RIGHT? PLS EXPLAIN.

Some people here come illegally, eg. A person who is in USA they just cross the border to look for new oportunities (different situations in every case). Others become illegal here e.g they come as Visitors and either do not renew their visa or just stay without immigration statatus after teh visa has expired.

Refugee is not an illegal status. But once your case is refused you need to leave and some people stay in Canada.

The Fan · Senior Member

i also know a lot of people that have came here ilegally, and most of them regret it they did it because of a BAD ADVISE from families and those piranas know as inmigration servives, most of them give them bad advise just to get money from them.

Most of the portuges that are been deported are because they were told to apply as REFUGIADOS and is well know that in PORTUGAL there is a democracy and no reason to claim refugio. so the blames go to the person that told them to apply as that, don't blame the goverment they just process the petition and realize they don't qualify as REFUGIADOS.

I think most of the people behind the WALK to PROTEST are probably those agencies that offer "Advise" to inmigrant just to cover there ass for giving the bad advise for and easy MONEY.

AND i am not CUADRADO and i am a CIRCLE (i am fat) and this is my opinion as a CANADIAN.

LaDyBuG · Comandante

CAN SOMEONE PLS ANSWER MY QUESTION.....

I STILL WANNA KNOW WHY PEOPLE COME HERE "ILLEGALLY"?

I MEAN....REFUGEE STATUS IS NOT AN ILEGAL THING....RIGHT?

PLS EXPLAIN.

confundida · Foro Master

bistor wrote:

confundida wrote: BISTOR WROTE: Canada does have arrangements with some countries so that foreign felons can serve their sentence in their home country. The treaties tend to go both ways, so that canadians convicted of a crime outside of Canada (there are plenty out there), can serve their time here. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW LONG THIS PROCESS IS?? DID YOU KNOW THAT CANADA DOESNT DO ANYTHING WITH THERE SO CALL TREAT, THEY ALSO PICK AND CHOOSE FROM ALL THOSE PPL TO COME BACK, COMING BACK TO CANADA TO SERVE YOUR SENTENCE IS LIKE WINNING THE LOTTERY......FROM WAT I KNOW AND IM EXPERIENCING THIS FIRST HAND THEY CAN SHOVED THAT TREATY UP THERE A$$!!! BISTOR DO ME A FAVOR EDUCATE YOURSELF A BIT MORE OUTSIDE BOOKS, TALK TO A PERSON WITH ILLEGAL STATUS HERE AND THEY CAN TELL YOU ALL THE STRUGGLES THAT THEY HAVE TO FACE...ANYWHERE FROM WORK TO HEALTH EVEN TO GET AN EDUCATION..... The law takes time to work... what do you propose? Other than not commiting the crime in the first place. Again, people that are here ILLEGALLY, shouldn't be here. I'm very sorry their ILLEGAL stay in this country isn't as comfy as they would like it to be. It goes without saying that they are more than welcome to return to their countries if they are unhappy with their ILLEGAL status here. And, yes, I do know people that are here illegaly. Who doesn't? Do they have my sympathy? No.

THERE IS NO POINT OF ARGUING OR DISCUSSING ANYTHING WITH U YOU JUST CUADRADO!!!

bistor · Guru

confundida wrote:

BISTOR WROTE:
Canada does have arrangements with some countries so that foreign felons can serve their sentence in their home country. The treaties tend to go both ways, so that canadians convicted of a crime outside of Canada (there are plenty out there), can serve their time here.
DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW LONG THIS PROCESS IS?? DID YOU KNOW THAT CANADA DOESNT DO ANYTHING WITH THERE SO CALL TREAT, THEY ALSO PICK AND CHOOSE FROM ALL THOSE PPL TO COME BACK, COMING BACK TO CANADA TO SERVE YOUR SENTENCE IS LIKE WINNING THE LOTTERY......FROM WAT I KNOW AND IM EXPERIENCING THIS FIRST HAND THEY CAN SHOVED THAT TREATY UP THERE A$$!!!
BISTOR DO ME A FAVOR EDUCATE YOURSELF A BIT MORE OUTSIDE BOOKS, TALK TO A PERSON WITH ILLEGAL STATUS HERE AND THEY CAN TELL YOU ALL THE STRUGGLES THAT THEY HAVE TO FACE...ANYWHERE FROM WORK TO HEALTH EVEN TO GET AN EDUCATION.....

The law takes time to work... what do you propose? Other than not commiting the crime in the first place.

Again, people that are here ILLEGALLY, shouldn't be here. I'm very sorry their ILLEGAL stay in this country isn't as comfy as they would like it to be.

It goes without saying that they are more than welcome to return to their countries if they are unhappy with their ILLEGAL status here.

And, yes, I do know people that are here illegaly. Who doesn't? Do they have my sympathy? No.

confundida · Foro Master

BISTOR WROTE:

Canada does have arrangements with some countries so that foreign felons can serve their sentence in their home country. The treaties tend to go both ways, so that canadians convicted of a crime outside of Canada (there are plenty out there), can serve their time here.

DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW LONG THIS PROCESS IS?? DID YOU KNOW THAT CANADA DOESNT DO ANYTHING WITH THERE SO CALL TREAT, THEY ALSO PICK AND CHOOSE FROM ALL THOSE PPL TO COME BACK, COMING BACK TO CANADA TO SERVE YOUR SENTENCE IS LIKE WINNING THE LOTTERY......FROM WAT I KNOW AND IM EXPERIENCING THIS FIRST HAND THEY CAN SHOVED THAT TREATY UP THERE A$$!!!

BISTOR DO ME A FAVOR EDUCATE YOURSELF A BIT MORE OUTSIDE BOOKS, TALK TO A PERSON WITH ILLEGAL STATUS HERE AND THEY CAN TELL YOU ALL THE STRUGGLES THAT THEY HAVE TO FACE...ANYWHERE FROM WORK TO HEALTH EVEN TO GET AN EDUCATION.....

GENIE · Foro Master

bistor wrote:

Genie, I'm not going to turn this into a pissing contest . I'm far from an expert in immigration matters, but I can tell you that as a former volunteer at the legal clinic of the centro para gente de habla hispana, I have had the opportunity to see dozens of immigration cases up close. I like to think I have some clue. You can apply for refugee status upon landing, yes. And, yes, you will be given a SIN card starting with a 9. You can go on welfare if you like, or you can work. The other ways to emigrate to Canada (skilled worker, investor) can't be processed upon landing. Marriage is another way to do it, but that doesn't happen at landing either. You cannot deport citizens, because, among other reasons, where are you going to deport them to? They are canadian. Yes, some foreigners are harder working than some canadians. But what exactly are you proposing? Should we shoot the canadians that are on welfare? Should we give all foreigners that are harder workers than some canadians, citizenship? Canada already takes in hundreds of thousands of hard-working foreigners legally every year. Why should I have any sympathy for people that felt they were smarter than the rest of those hundreds of thousands of people that followed the rules? Canada does have arrangements with some countries so that foreign felons can serve their sentence in their home country. The treaties tend to go both ways, so that canadians convicted of a crime outside of Canada (there are plenty out there), can serve their time here. We don't have treaties with all countries, among other reasons, because we don't believe all legal and penal systems afford the same guarantees as ours. Would you prefer to see that foreigner released to his home country, on the street after a couple of months home, or would you prefer him to serve his full sentence in Canada, and then deported? I prefer the second option. Regarding the cost of keeping a prisoner in jail, all I can say it's peanuts compared to the billions of dollars in taxes we pay every year, and, so far as I'm concerned, it's money well spent. Justice is worth more than a few thousand dollars a year. Regarding your friend's case in particular, I really can't comment because I don't know the specifics. But the circumstances surrounding his/her case seem to be absolutely stupendous. Correct me if I'm mistaken, but you're telling me that after twenty years in Canada (the average refugee claim takes no longer than 5 years), waiting for their papers to be cleared, and having them lost by the government, they were still afraid of the police and government officials? Wow. All I can say is that these are very freak circumstances, and your friend has had extraordinarily bad luck. I feel sorry for him/her, but no law can cover all circumstances, much less circumstances as off-the-wall as these. -- Edited by bistor at 10:46, 2006-03-31

you know what bistor u may have experience pero hasta ke no estes en una situation that requires you to make a decision about Immigration and see it first hand!! or understand why ppl come here the way the do! Then i suggest you do more Volunteer work and see why it drives them to do what they did!!

Otra cosa I believe that deporting an illegal felon is much more worse then keeping them here im sorry i would rather my Tax dollars go some where else!

Y tambien like u said u dont know the details asi ke not te la lleves de ke sabes todo or a bit!! cuz in my opinion ur experience showed u nothing!!!

But thats it for now! Because you havent lived in our countries and its not so easy!!

bistor · Guru

GENIE wrote:

bistor wrote:

Genie, our tax dollars go to support, firstly, the interests of citizens i guess ur not too familiar with immigration as you think u are!!! First off when you land here or frist apply for ur status they give you welfare untill your case gets reviewed and you get issued a temporary SIN Card!!! . If a citizen decides to have six children, that's very much her right, as long as she can take care of them.So our tax dollars going to fund a mother who has 6 children and is living off welfare is better to keep here then a family of 4-5 who have busted there butt to offer there kids a better life by WORKING??? If she can't take care of them, our (also funded by your taxes) child protection agency will make sure to take them away from her OH YEAH THATS AN EVEN BETTER SOLUTION!!!! . I don't see a problem in making sure illegal aliens serve jail time for a crime they've commited in Canada. They will be deported after they complete their all expenses paid vacation in Kingston, courtesy of corrections canada. SO LETS PAY TO HAVE A CRIMINAL SERVE TIME HERE BEING AN ILLEGAL ALIEN IS BETTER THEN HAVING CANADA MAKE ARRANGEMENTS WITH HIS COUNTRY AND HAVE HIM SERVE TIME DOWN THERE!!! YEAH LETS PUNISH HIM BY SERVING HIM THREE MEALS A DAY AND A BED TO SLEEP ON AND EXTRA CIRICULAR ACTIVITIES!!! YEAH!!! GREAT!! Your friend's case is unfortunate, though I have to wonder why they didn't regularize their situation. If they did that well they would have no problem emigrating to Canada as investors.VERY EASY THEY HAD THERE SIN CARD SO THEY WERE ENTITLED TO WORK HOWEVER THEY JUST THOUGHT THERE PAPERS WHERE IN THE WORKS IM SORRY BUT WHEN U COME HERE NOT SPEAKING THE LANGUAGE TOO WELL AND ARE TERRIFIED OF POLICE OR GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS CUZ OF HORROR STORIES THEN U JUST LET BIGONS BE BYEGONS!!!
EDUCATE URSELF!!! I KNOW THE IMMIGRATION SYSTEM VERY WELL ME AND EX HUSBAND WENT THRU IT EXTENSIVILY!!! I HAVE DONE MY RESEARCH INVESTIGATED EVERY ANGLE AND CORNER OF IT I KNOW WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT!!!

Genie,

I'm not going to turn this into a pissing contest

. I'm far from an expert in immigration matters, but I can tell you that as a former volunteer at the legal clinic of the centro para gente de habla hispana, I have had the opportunity to see dozens of immigration cases up close. I like to think I have some clue.

You can apply for refugee status upon landing, yes. And, yes, you will be given a SIN card starting with a 9. You can go on welfare if you like, or you can work. The other ways to emigrate to Canada (skilled worker, investor) can't be processed upon landing. Marriage is another way to do it, but that doesn't happen at landing either.

You cannot deport citizens, because, among other reasons, where are you going to deport them to? They are canadian. Yes, some foreigners are harder working than some canadians. But what exactly are you proposing? Should we shoot the canadians that are on welfare? Should we give all foreigners that are harder workers than some canadians, citizenship? Canada already takes in hundreds of thousands of hard-working foreigners legally every year. Why should I have any sympathy for people that felt they were smarter than the rest of those hundreds of thousands of people that followed the rules?

Canada does have arrangements with some countries so that foreign felons can serve their sentence in their home country. The treaties tend to go both ways, so that canadians convicted of a crime outside of Canada (there are plenty out there), can serve their time here.

We don't have treaties with all countries, among other reasons, because we don't believe all legal and penal systems afford the same guarantees as ours. Would you prefer to see that foreigner released to his home country, on the street after a couple of months home, or would you prefer him to serve his full sentence in Canada, and then deported? I prefer the second option. Regarding the cost of keeping a prisoner in jail, all I can say it's peanuts compared to the billions of dollars in taxes we pay every year, and, so far as I'm concerned, it's money well spent. Justice is worth more than a few thousand dollars a year.

Regarding your friend's case in particular, I really can't comment because I don't know the specifics. But the circumstances surrounding his/her case seem to be absolutely stupendous.

Correct me if I'm mistaken, but you're telling me that after twenty years in Canada (the average refugee claim takes no longer than 5 years), waiting for their papers to be cleared, and having them lost by the government, they were still afraid of the police and government officials?

Wow.

All I can say is that these are very freak circumstances, and your friend has had extraordinarily bad luck. I feel sorry for him/her, but no law can cover all circumstances, much less circumstances as off-the-wall as these.

-- Edited by bistor at 10:46, 2006-03-31

GENIE · Foro Master

bistor wrote:

Genie, our tax dollars go to support, firstly, the interests of citizens i guess ur not too familiar with immigration as you think u are!!! First off when you land here or frist apply for ur status they give you welfare untill your case gets reviewed and you get issued a temporary SIN Card!!! . If a citizen decides to have six children, that's very much her right, as long as she can take care of them.So our tax dollars going to fund a mother who has 6 children and is living off welfare is better to keep here then a family of 4-5 who have busted there butt to offer there kids a better life by WORKING??? If she can't take care of them, our (also funded by your taxes) child protection agency will make sure to take them away from her OH YEAH THATS AN EVEN BETTER SOLUTION!!!! . I don't see a problem in making sure illegal aliens serve jail time for a crime they've commited in Canada. They will be deported after they complete their all expenses paid vacation in Kingston, courtesy of corrections canada. SO LETS PAY TO HAVE A CRIMINAL SERVE TIME HERE BEING AN ILLEGAL ALIEN IS BETTER THEN HAVING CANADA MAKE ARRANGEMENTS WITH HIS COUNTRY AND HAVE HIM SERVE TIME DOWN THERE!!! YEAH LETS PUNISH HIM BY SERVING HIM THREE MEALS A DAY AND A BED TO SLEEP ON AND EXTRA CIRICULAR ACTIVITIES!!! YEAH!!! GREAT!! Your friend's case is unfortunate, though I have to wonder why they didn't regularize their situation. If they did that well they would have no problem emigrating to Canada as investors.VERY EASY THEY HAD THERE SIN CARD SO THEY WERE ENTITLED TO WORK HOWEVER THEY JUST THOUGHT THERE PAPERS WHERE IN THE WORKS IM SORRY BUT WHEN U COME HERE NOT SPEAKING THE LANGUAGE TOO WELL AND ARE TERRIFIED OF POLICE OR GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS CUZ OF HORROR STORIES THEN U JUST LET BIGONS BE BYEGONS!!!

EDUCATE URSELF!!! I KNOW THE IMMIGRATION SYSTEM VERY WELL ME AND EX HUSBAND WENT THRU IT EXTENSIVILY!!! I HAVE DONE MY RESEARCH INVESTIGATED EVERY ANGLE AND CORNER OF IT I KNOW WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT!!!

bistor · Guru

Salsera de Corazon wrote:

Didn't you read what she said, A FAMILY WHO HAD BEEN HERE 20YRS HAD BEEN WAITING FOR THERE PAPERS AND JUST NOW GOT TOLD THEY WERE GONNA BE DEPORTED SOON!!! THE FATHER OWNS YES OWNS THREE HOMES AND A CONSTUCTION COMPANY HE HAS EVERYTHING LEGIT!! THE GOVERMENT MISPLACED THERE FILE AND WELL NOW WHAT HE HAS TO GO BACK HOME??? So what they misplaced their file and now happens? Of course nothing they probably said SORRY to them, and that is it, because here in Canada for everything they answer you back I AM SORRY

I don't know of any emigration process that takes twenty years.

The federal government simply "misplacing" papers sounds equally fantastic.

But who knows, I guess.

Chilenita · Comandante

So anyway who is going tomorrow?

Salsera de Corazon · TOP Guru

bistor wrote:

GENIE wrote: PRINCESSA wrote: El Representante wrote: - Ecuadorian Protests - When Angry Ecuadorians Go After Politicians . . . Fac - That's Something Else . . . OMG so Funny & so True !!! Sad, bad or not I'm TOTALLY with Immigration Raids, it's about time Canada got some balls & gets tight & tough. If you want to live in Canada then do it the right way, if you don't get visa, then too bad for you. Life is tough & unfair, so it's about time we get rid of a whole bunch of illegals. I THINK THIS IS SUCH A BAD WAY OF THINKING! ONE REASON BEING THIS COULD BE SOMEONE IN UR FAMILY!! THEN U WOULD CHANGE UR MIND! OH AND DONT SAY NO CUZ I KNOW UR PRIMOS AND I KNOW THERE STORIES!!! ANOTHER THING SOME OF THE PPL THERE SENDING BACK ARE GOOD HARD WORKING PPL!!! BUT YET UR TAX DOLLARS ARE GOING AND SUPPORTING MOTHER WITH ABOUT 6 KIDS AND PREGNANT HERE WAITING FOR THERE PAPERS!! NOW THAT I DONT AGREE WITH MY SISTER IN LAW (SOON TO BE) WAS TELLING ME OF A FAMILY WHO HAD BEEN HERE 20YRS HAD BEEN WAITING FOR THERE PAPERS AND JUST NOW GOT TOLD THEY WERE GONNA BE DEPORTED SOON!!! THE FATHER OWNS YES OWNS THREE HOMES AND A CONSTUCTION COMPANY HE HAS EVERYTHING LEGIT!! THE GOVERMENT MISPLACED THERE FILE AND WELL NOW WHAT HE HAS TO GO BACK HOME??? IM SORRY GIRL BUT SOMETIMES ITS CUZ OF UNEDUCATED IGNORANT THINKERS LIKE URSELF THAT WE END UP KEEPING THE CRACK HEAD KILLERS HERE!!! DID U ALL KNOW THAT CURRENTLY THERE ARE 150 ILLIGAL CRIMINALS THAT WE HAVE KEPT HERE IN JAIL!!! THAT U AND ME ARE SUPPORTING WHY CUZ THATS WHERE OUR TAXES GO!! OH BUT LETS SEND BACK ALL THE HARD WORKERS!!! BULL SHIT!!!! Genie, our tax dollars go to support, firstly, the interests of citizens. If a citizen decides to have six children, that's very much her right, as long as she can take care of them. If she can't take care of them, our (also funded by your taxes) child protection agency will make sure to take them away from her. I don't see a problem in making sure illegal aliens serve jail time for a crime they've commited in Canada. They will be deported after they complete their all expenses paid vacation in Kingston, courtesy of corrections canada. Your friend's case is unfortunate, though I have to wonder why they didn't regularize their situation. If they did that well they would have no problem emigrating to Canada as investors.

Didn't you read what she said, A FAMILY WHO HAD BEEN HERE 20YRS HAD BEEN WAITING FOR THERE PAPERS AND JUST NOW GOT TOLD THEY WERE GONNA BE DEPORTED SOON!!! THE FATHER OWNS YES OWNS THREE HOMES AND A CONSTUCTION COMPANY HE HAS EVERYTHING LEGIT!! THE GOVERMENT MISPLACED THERE FILE AND WELL NOW WHAT HE HAS TO GO BACK HOME??? So what they misplaced their file and now happens? Of course nothing they probably said SORRY to them, and that is it, because here in Canada for everything they answer you back I AM SORRY

bistor · Guru

GENIE wrote:

PRINCESSA wrote:
El Representante wrote: - Ecuadorian Protests - When Angry Ecuadorians Go After Politicians . . . Fac - That's Something Else . . . OMG so Funny & so True !!! Sad, bad or not I'm TOTALLY with Immigration Raids, it's about time Canada got some balls & gets tight & tough. If you want to live in Canada then do it the right way, if you don't get visa, then too bad for you. Life is tough & unfair, so it's about time we get rid of a whole bunch of illegals.

           I THINK THIS IS SUCH A BAD WAY OF THINKING! ONE REASON BEING THIS COULD BE SOMEONE IN UR FAMILY!! THEN U WOULD CHANGE UR MIND! OH AND DONT SAY NO CUZ I KNOW UR PRIMOS AND I KNOW THERE STORIES!!!
          ANOTHER THING SOME OF THE PPL THERE SENDING BACK ARE GOOD HARD WORKING PPL!!! BUT YET UR TAX DOLLARS ARE GOING AND SUPPORTING MOTHER WITH ABOUT 6 KIDS AND PREGNANT HERE WAITING FOR THERE PAPERS!! NOW THAT I DONT AGREE WITH
           MY SISTER IN LAW (SOON TO BE) WAS TELLING ME OF A FAMILY WHO HAD BEEN HERE 20YRS HAD BEEN WAITING FOR THERE PAPERS AND JUST NOW GOT TOLD THEY WERE GONNA BE DEPORTED SOON!!! THE FATHER OWNS YES OWNS THREE HOMES AND A CONSTUCTION COMPANY HE HAS EVERYTHING LEGIT!! THE GOVERMENT MISPLACED THERE FILE AND WELL NOW WHAT HE HAS TO GO BACK HOME???
       IM SORRY GIRL BUT SOMETIMES ITS CUZ OF UNEDUCATED IGNORANT THINKERS LIKE URSELF THAT WE END UP KEEPING THE CRACK HEAD KILLERS HERE!!!
          DID U ALL KNOW THAT CURRENTLY THERE ARE 150 ILLIGAL CRIMINALS THAT WE HAVE KEPT HERE IN JAIL!!! THAT U AND ME ARE SUPPORTING WHY CUZ THATS WHERE OUR TAXES GO!! OH BUT LETS SEND BACK ALL THE HARD WORKERS!!!
BULL SHIT!!!!

Genie, our tax dollars go to support, firstly, the interests of citizens. If a citizen decides to have six children, that's very much her right, as long as she can take care of them. If she can't take care of them, our (also funded by your taxes) child protection agency will make sure to take them away from her.

I don't see a problem in making sure illegal aliens serve jail time for a crime they've commited in Canada. They will be deported after they complete their all expenses paid vacation in Kingston, courtesy of corrections canada.

Your friend's case is unfortunate, though I have to wonder why they didn't regularize their situation. If they did that well they would have no problem emigrating to Canada as investors.

Salsera de Corazon · TOP Guru

God wrote:

Every time I see threads like this one makes me wonder....NO ONE has been Illegal in here never ????? aye aye aye bunch of liars !

Yes I agree with you, my parents were illegal at the beginning and I AM VERY PROUD OF THEM

Chilenita · Comandante

God wrote:

Every time I see threads like this one makes me wonder....NO ONE has been Illegal in here never ????? aye aye aye bunch of liars !

Finally I like your avatar!

When my parents came to Canada it ws because of extreme circumstances in Chile and they had all their papers before even landing in this country. Thanks to the best Prime Minister ever Pierre Trudeau. Too bad the liberals are out of office :(

Anyhow I think those who do not understand how or why a family would come her illegally has never had to go through hard times back in their country. There are people that can NOT make ends meat back home and come here illegally out of desperation.

bistor · Guru

I've never been illegal, and, frankly, I don't think it's that difficult to follow the rules of the country that is hosting you. If you don't like them, by all means, pick another country which to emigrate to.

No nation other than your own has the obligation to provide you a livelihood.

GENIE · Foro Master

PRINCESSA wrote:

El Representante wrote: - Ecuadorian Protests - When Angry Ecuadorians Go After Politicians . . . Fac - That's Something Else . . . OMG so Funny & so True !!! Sad, bad or not I'm TOTALLY with Immigration Raids, it's about time Canada got some balls & gets tight & tough. If you want to live in Canada then do it the right way, if you don't get visa, then too bad for you. Life is tough & unfair, so it's about time we get rid of a whole bunch of illegals.

I THINK THIS IS SUCH A BAD WAY OF THINKING! ONE REASON BEING THIS COULD BE SOMEONE IN UR FAMILY!! THEN U WOULD CHANGE UR MIND! OH AND DONT SAY NO CUZ I KNOW UR PRIMOS AND I KNOW THERE STORIES!!!

ANOTHER THING SOME OF THE PPL THERE SENDING BACK ARE GOOD HARD WORKING PPL!!! BUT YET UR TAX DOLLARS ARE GOING AND SUPPORTING MOTHER WITH ABOUT 6 KIDS AND PREGNANT HERE WAITING FOR THERE PAPERS!! NOW THAT I DONT AGREE WITH

MY SISTER IN LAW (SOON TO BE) WAS TELLING ME OF A FAMILY WHO HAD BEEN HERE 20YRS HAD BEEN WAITING FOR THERE PAPERS AND JUST NOW GOT TOLD THEY WERE GONNA BE DEPORTED SOON!!! THE FATHER OWNS YES OWNS THREE HOMES AND A CONSTUCTION COMPANY HE HAS EVERYTHING LEGIT!! THE GOVERMENT MISPLACED THERE FILE AND WELL NOW WHAT HE HAS TO GO BACK HOME???

IM SORRY GIRL BUT SOMETIMES ITS CUZ OF UNEDUCATED IGNORANT THINKERS LIKE URSELF THAT WE END UP KEEPING THE CRACK HEAD KILLERS HERE!!!

DID U ALL KNOW THAT CURRENTLY THERE ARE 150 ILLIGAL CRIMINALS THAT WE HAVE KEPT HERE IN JAIL!!! THAT U AND ME ARE SUPPORTING WHY CUZ THATS WHERE OUR TAXES GO!! OH BUT LETS SEND BACK ALL THE HARD WORKERS!!!

BULL SHIT!!!!

Julie · Comandante

NO, never nor in Mx which I was pretty close to at one point but I did anything legally, possible to avoid putting myself in this position.

God · Foro Master

Every time I see threads like this one makes me wonder....NO ONE has been Illegal in here never ????? aye aye aye bunch of liars !

LaDyBuG · Comandante

I'm just wandering why people come here ilegally?

I have a problem with ilegal criminals....but not good, hard working people....

It sucks for all those people who have established ties here and have made a home....to go back to NOTHING....and break all ties here.....talk about heart-breaking.....

I'm sure we all know one or two people who have been deported and it's such a sad thing....

bistor · Guru

The difference is probably that staying illegally in Canada and throwing molotov cocktails around in the country that is feeding you is a great way to get a quickie deportation!

I would be quite surprised if that sort of idiocy happened.

PRINCESSA · TOP Guru

El Representante wrote:

- Ecuadorian Protests - When Angry Ecuadorians Go After Politicians . . . Fac - That's Something Else . . .

OMG so Funny & so True !!!

Sad, bad or not I'm TOTALLY with Immigration Raids, it's about time Canada got some balls & gets tight & tough.

If you want to live in Canada then do it the right way, if you don't get visa, then too bad for you. Life is tough & unfair, so it's about time we get rid of a whole bunch of illegals.

confundida · Foro Master

TRUST ME IN ARGENTINA THERE JUST PLAIN WACK!!

THEY WILL PROTEST OVER ANYTHING AND EVERYONE......

El Representante · Guru

- Ecuadorian Protests -

When Angry Ecuadorians Go After Politicians . . .

Fac - That's Something Else . . .

Chilenita · Comandante

confundida wrote:

TV Buff wrote: From what I understand (and my mother told me that Vilma Filici has been talking about this on the radio a lot) is that what they're trying to do is very similar to what they did in the States, with a very peaceful protest, people wearing white, bring the kids kinda thing. Even in L.A., where the organizers planned it well ahead of time, you would think that L.A. = gangs = violence, but everything went over peacefully (read Lab's thread on this). So I'm sure it'll be peaceful (plus, have you seen Canadian protests? Nothing like my good-old Nicaraguan blood baths). I VE SEEN CANADIAN PROTEST AND THERE A JOKE!!! ITS A COUPLE OF THEM STANDING OUTSIDE WITH A CIGARRETE AND A TIMMY CUP OR SITTING ON THERE LAWN CHAIR..... BUFFY, U HAVE TO SEE THE PROTEST IN ARGENTINA.....

Okay you people are just NUTS!!! I saw one in Buenos Aires when I was there and it was a bunch of people in masks throwing bottles everywhere! I am not sure that is the way to protest either...it makes the group look like a bunch of violent wackos. Imagine they did that on Sat...act like a bunch of wackos and demand the goverment to let them stay.....

@Julie..lol no worries I am a rally expert - lol

Julie · Comandante

confundida wrote:

I VE SEEN CANADIAN PROTEST AND THERE A JOKE!!! ITS A COUPLE OF THEM STANDING OUTSIDE WITH A CIGARRETE AND A TIMMY CUP OR SITTING ON THERE LAWN CHAIR..... BUFFY, U HAVE TO SEE THE PROTEST IN ARGENTINA.....

Look at the one in France right now, crazy.

I've been to few back in Paris, when the special forces (CRS, for riots and things) charge, you don't want to be around. I guess it is the same thing in Argentina (ucha destruccion y herridos no ?)

confundida · Foro Master

TV Buff wrote:

From what I understand (and my mother told me that Vilma Filici has been talking about this on the radio a lot) is that what they're trying to do is very similar to what they did in the States, with a very peaceful protest, people wearing white, bring the kids kinda thing. Even in L.A., where the organizers planned it well ahead of time, you would think that L.A. = gangs = violence, but everything went over peacefully (read Lab's thread on this). So I'm sure it'll be peaceful (plus, have you seen Canadian protests? Nothing like my good-old Nicaraguan blood baths).

I VE SEEN CANADIAN PROTEST AND THERE A JOKE!!! ITS A COUPLE OF THEM STANDING OUTSIDE WITH A CIGARRETE AND A TIMMY CUP OR SITTING ON THERE LAWN CHAIR.....

BUFFY, U HAVE TO SEE THE PROTEST IN ARGENTINA.....

Julie · Comandante

Chilenita wrote:

Hummm I know what you mean Julie. Well I think people should try and enter Canada Legally but I feel for what is happening to these people and I don't like the way they are doing it. These US type raids...I hate it. Since it's happening to Latinos I'll go....any rally against the things that seem to be happening since Harper took over I'll go to....

Please Chile, be extra careful, we don't want anything to happen to 1/3, 1/3 and 1/3

I am sure it will be super peaceful, but mas vale prevenir que lamentar.

TV Buff · TOP Guru

From what I understand (and my mother told me that Vilma Filici has been talking about this on the radio a lot) is that what they're trying to do is very similar to what they did in the States, with a very peaceful protest, people wearing white, bring the kids kinda thing. Even in L.A., where the organizers planned it well ahead of time, you would think that L.A. = gangs = violence, but everything went over peacefully (read Lab's thread on this). So I'm sure it'll be peaceful (plus, have you seen Canadian protests? Nothing like my good-old Nicaraguan blood baths).

Chilenita · Comandante

Hummm I know what you mean Julie. Well I think people should try and enter Canada Legally but I feel for what is happening to these people and I don't like the way they are doing it. These US type raids...I hate it.

Since it's happening to Latinos I'll go....any rally against the things that seem to be happening since Harper took over I'll go to....

McOSIRIS · Comandante

I can't go...I'll be working....

stay home and watch my show....

Rogers channel 10 @ 5PM

God · Foro Master

McOSIRIS wrote:

God wrote:
nahhhhhhhhh any sort protest provides you of very good facial expressions
not to mention the extra elements such as tear gas, water, cops in horses, blood, rocks flying...etc...

since Latinos are envolve I would change those elements...LMAO Tacos, tamales, pupusas, empanadas flying LMAO<

@ Confu....Let's say in Art's Name

@ Julie...Sentimientos encontrados..a que es eso.....

-- Edited by God at 15:01, 2006-03-30

Julie · Comandante

Tengo sentimientos encontrados ahi. Mostly because I don't know the law well enough to forge me an opinion as if those raids are legal or not bla bla bla

And I don't like when pple are trying to cocowash me which will probably happen on Saturday. Grrrr I don't know, I guess it will be a last minute call for me.